From the M-KOS archives: Marcel Dzama interview

Marcel Dzama, The Queen’s Ghost Vanish’d From Our Sight, 2013. Ink, gouache, and graphite on piano paper (2 scrolls) Courtesy of the artist and David Zwirner Gallery, NY/London

To underline Marcel Dzama’s current exhibition “Puppets, Pawns, and Prophets“ at David Zwirner in London until 11 May, M-KOS is posting once more its interview recorded with Dzama in 2011, when he visited Montreal for the screenings of his “A Game of Chess” (2011) and “Death Disco Dance” (2011) videos at POP festival. For this latest exhibition at Zwirner, Dzama shows new drawings, sculptures and videos that include “Death Disco Dance” as well as the more recent “Sister Squares” (2012), considered the sequel to his “A Game of Chess” video. In the following interview, although already one and a half years old, Dzama talks about how the making of Death Disco Dance, and the influence of Marcel Duchamp that is undoubtedly manifested in many of his work.

The following interview was originally published on 30 September 2011, with the addition of more recent images.

Marcel Dzama, Death Disco Dance, 2011. video still. Courtesy the artist and David Zwiener, NY/London

Last week’s 2011 edition of ArtPop – the visual arts wing of the annual music festival Pop Montreal – showcased Marcel Dzama’s recent films “A Game of Chess” (2011) and “Death Disco Dance” (2011). The former was premiered in his solo exhibition “Behind Every Curtain” at David Zwirner Gallery in New York earlier this year. This black and white film reveals Dzama’s inspiration and nostalgia of Bauhaus, Duchamp and yet retains a strong story telling sense, in a very personal aesthetic that resonates with contemporary life. An offshoot of “A Game of Chess”, the four-minutes colour film “Death Disco Dance” is more spontaneous and upbeat, and found a world premier at ArtPop. M-KOS interviewed Dzama during his Montreal pop-over.

M-KOS: Is this your first time back in Montreal since your retrospective at the Museum of Contemporary Art of Montreal in 2010?

Marcel Dzama: Yes. This is the first time since then. It is very nice to be here in fall instead of winter.

Dzama: Well, it’s beautiful in winter as well but it’s much nicer now.

MK: You are here for POP Festival?

Dzama: Yes. I’m showing two films – one is a short film called “Death Disco Dance”, almost like a little music video or an art film, with a Post punk soundtrack which I played with the special guest band with a live sound system.

The other one is called “A Game of Chess”. It’s a 15 minutes film that was shot in Guadalajara, in Mexico. I had a friend who had a ceramic foundry there. I was making ceramic sculptures. Originally I had the idea of shooting film at my studio in New York but my friend at the foundry said “shoot it here, I have all the connections of people here!”. So I had the ballet company of Guadalajara perform in the film and I made these papier maché costumes there which was a lot of fun to be in Mexico instead of being in my studio making them. And a lot of people were helping me as well in making them.

MK: So “A Game of Chess” is a Montreal première…

Dzama: Yes it’s a Montreal première, actually a Canadian première and “Death Disco Dance” is a world première.

MK: A world première? Is “Death Disco Dance” a commission from Pop Montreal?

Dzama: No it just happened that when I was making this film, a friend of mine was working at the [POP] festival, He heard I was making these films and he said “we should include these”. It was a nice coincidence.

MK: I didn’t see the exhibition at MACM because I wasn’t in Montreal at that time, but I saw your show at David Zwirner in New York last February which I really like.

Dzama: So, you’ve already seen “A Game of Chess”. I only showed it in New York that time, I also showed it in Germany a few months ago, so these are the only two times I have shown this film.

MK: That particular film, at David Zwirner gallery you exhibited a lot of props from within the film. Are these the ones you made in Guadalajara?

Dzama: Yes, do you remember the piece like a little merry-go-round in the middle of the space? They’re the figures of the characters in the film. When I was in Mexico, there was a market where they had these recycled Coke cans made into toys. That’s where I got the idea making this piece.

Marcel Dzama, Sister Squares, 2012. Video still. Courtesy the artist and David Zwirner, NY/London

MK: There’s a strong connection to early 20th century art films like Cocteau’s in your work…

Dzama: For that film, I was very influenced by Oskar Schlemmer from Bauhaus. He made a little ballet with costumes that limited the dancer’s movements. When I was making costumes for my film, I was thinking about chess and the way the chess pieces move. So I was trying to make these costumes that the dancers would move in the patterns of how the chess pieces move. It ended up not happening but that was the original idea. So in the end I turned it into a different idea.

MK: And Death Disco Dance… Is that the name of a band?

Dzama: No. Actually for the original soundtrack it was just me with a little drum machine. It’s the corniest soundtrack, it’s just me playing a disco drum beat. So I named it after that. After I finished filming “A Game of Chess” I had some extra time with the dancers and film crew so we set up a shoot in a factory that was torn down, it was called Canada Shoe. I found it very funny to shoot it there. It was more of a celebration of finishing the shoot of the original film. It’s kind of little dance number that I improvised with the choreographer two minutes before we filmed it… so it’s kind of this weird disco dance, it’s only for four minutes long.

MK: Are you showing the props with the film for POP Festival ?

Dzama: No. Just the films. I might have storyboards for “A Game of Chess” but I haven’t been into the space yet, I’m not sure if there’s room to set it up.

MK: Are you planning to show other aspects of the film ?

Dzama: No, I don’t think there was any budget to bring props or anything like that.

Marcel Dzama, “Behind Every Curtain” Exhibition view at David Zwirner, 2011. Courtesy of the artist and David Zwirner, NY/London.

MK: You are a Canadian artist, originally from Winnipeg, now you’re living in New York enjoying the career of an international artist. You are also part of the exhibition “My Winnipeg”* at La Maison Rouge in Paris. Do you feel there is now lots of enthusiasm for the School of Winnipeg?

Dzama: There are a few artists from Winnipeg that I feel connected with, but there’s always others that I don’t feel close to. I was neighbors with Guy Maddin. We talked about films a lot. We both had a same aesthetic of nostalgia when working with that genre. So I guess there’s that school of thought.

Winnipeg peaked in the 1920s, and it’s been on a decline since then. So there is a real feeling of ghost history that happened there. My studio in Winnipeg was very rundown and everything was made in 20s. It really feels like ghosts are working with you when you’re there.

I found Winnipeg, now being in New York, a little bit less nostalgic but that’s how people still sees it, I guess, the ones still there.

MK: It gets too cold in Winnipeg…

Dzama: Cold kept me in the basement working a lot, that was the one good thing about it, but it gets a bit miserable sometimes…

MK: Your work has, as you said, has a nostalgic aspect, yet at the same time it has a very modern feel.

Dzama: I like playing with mechanical, figurative mix of styles, that’s an influence from Bauhaus.

Marcel Dzama “The Revolution’s been defeated, before you begin” (2010) Graphite, watercolor, and ink on paper. Courtesy of the artist and David Zwirner Gallery

MK: But there’s also an influence that feels like old eastern bloc imagery.

Dzama: Yeah. I’m a huge fan of Francis Picabia, his early mechanical drawings always click with me every now and then. The whole “A Game of Chess” film is an homage to Marcel Duchamp’s obsession with chess. I’m probably too much of a fan of Duchamp, he really influences my work.

MK: You said you are close to Guy Maddin. Do you have any plan to do a project together in the future?

Dzama: I talked with him before about maybe doing something together but we are both so busy with our own projects. We both appreciate each other and when he comes to New York we always see each other. We are just good friends.

MK: Any other projects you want to mention?

Dzama: I’m having a big show in Germany now. It’s in a small town called Braunschweig, 30 minutes outside from Berlin. It’s in an old castle turned into a museum. I filled 17 rooms in the castle with my work. Probably it’s my biggest retrospective so far.

MK: You’re showing works from the last 10 years or so?

Dzama: Well, all the works of the 2000s.

MK: So after this, will you move on to another film or go back to the studio and produce more object-based work?

Dzama: I like jumping around. If one starts to get boring and feel like work, then I switch medium. I always like going back to drawings. It feels the most intimate. When I get bored I start doing drawings, little storyboard drawings. For the sculptures, I also start doing drawings. Always draw first and then other things. So that’s what I’ll be up to for now. ■

Interviewd by Oli Sorenson
 

Marcel Dzama, Shall We Venture Outside, 2013. Ink, gouache, and graphite on paper. Courtesy the artist and David Zwirner, NY/London

Marcel Dzama
Puppets, Pawns and Prophets
6 April – 11 May 2013
at David Zwirner
24 Grafton Street,
London WC
davidzwirner.com